Live water

for matters relating to dowsing for water supplies including wells, boreholes, heat pumps and other services.

Live water

Postby Dan Wilson » Fri Jul 22, 2005 4:19 pm

I was very interested in Jim Kuebelbeck's letter in DT recently remarking on "live water" which seems to be magical water which appears in difficult circumstances and never goes down in yield and purity once accessed.

I remembered Gordon Wright's story of his father when official Rhodesian water-diviner remarking that there was a curious thing about big supplies for estates, they were always available to the exact yield required and hadn't been there when the estate was previously dowsed. Both Gordon and his father dowse as locators of "live water" of which this is also a characteristic.

With this in mind, I reapplied my mind to the well belonging to my hosts the FitzGeralds in Spain who now invite me out there for four weeks every year. Two main dowsing exercises have been applied to the source for this well over the years, a sealing-off of neighbouring cesspit water which was contaminating it in the dry season, mainly conducted by American Mallory Cross at my invitation, and a piece of "distant water diversion" applied to the source which is predominantly Andalusian reservoir leakage, to bump it up a bit. Both these were successful.

The idea that you can have all the water you want and perfectly pure rather appealed to me, so I quizzed the garden for this novel supply. It said well, there's quite a good dome about 40 ft from the well. I then asked if we couldn't have some mental water diversion from it in favour of the well ? and the response was "well, there's some much easier live water diversion you can have right next to the existing supply". I said well, we'd have that in the interim, when would it deliver ? and the answer was, immediately.

I said nothing, thinking my hosts would think me as idiotic as you are at this moment, and that evening Mr F who measures the well level every day exclaimed "it's gone up by a foot !". I suggested he test it for quantity and from then on he has been running his garden sprinklers off it - unthinkable a week earlier.

So, for me the rumour is true. No digging, you just snap your fingers. Try it for yourself.
Dan Wilson
 

live water

Postby Chris hagey » Mon Jul 25, 2005 5:55 pm

Dan this is interesting but I am confused ...what are you actually "doing" here with this to get the live water ??

We do not have a well , it is the city water supply. Quantity is therefore not the issue but quality sure would be. Does this live water idea work for that as well ? Are you tapping into aquafers...what exactly are you moving in terms of water element? I would like very much to under
Thanks much,
Chris
Chris hagey
 

Re: live water

Postby Ian Pegler » Tue Jul 26, 2005 6:51 am

Chris hagey wrote:Dan this is interesting but I am confused ...what are you actually "doing" here with this to get the live water ??

We do not have a well , it is the city water supply. Quantity is therefore not the issue but quality sure would be. Does this live water idea work for that as well ? Are you tapping into aquafers...what exactly are you moving in terms of water element? I would like very much to under
Thanks much,
Chris


The whole thing with "live" or "primary" water began with a Stockholm professor of mineralology called A. E. Nordenskiold who wrote a paper theorising that some water might be generated through chemical processes deep within the Earth's crust.

This is in sharp contradistinction to conventional hydrological theory which says that rainclouds precipitate as rain which either evaporates, runs off into rivers or seeps down into aquifers to become "ground water", etc.

It was regarded by the scientific establishment as heresey for a long time. A mining engineer called Stephan Riess used Nordenskiold's theory and battled against the establishment to prove his point, and it got quite nasty - see chapters 8 & 9 of Christopher Bird's "The Divining Hand" for a detailed account.

I'm not sure what the current state of play is, in terms of establishment science. My Penguin Dictionary of Physical Geography contains the following definition:

juvenille water - Hot water of Magmatic origin derived from the Earth's interior and not from atmospheric or surface water.


Dowsers in the past have theorised that "geo-spirals" (see Guy Underwood's Pattern of the Past) are caused by primary water rising up through the rock until they meet an impermeable layer where it "domes", making a "blind-spring" and seeps out any which way it can.

Although Underwood talks about blind springs, there is no mention of "primary water" per se in his work. It seems to have been retrospectively applied by subsequent dowsers.

I don't believe there is anything magical about it, personally. Moreover, primary water has the advantage that it is unpolluted. The idea needs to be looked at seriously by geologists, especially now.

It is interesting that George Applegate's book makes no mention whatsoever of primary water.

I find it hard to reconcile part one of his book with part two. In what way do aquifers bear any resemblance to the "triple bands" he detects wqith his rod?

Ian
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Re: live water

Postby Dan Wilson » Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:51 am

Chris wrote:Dan this is interesting but I am confused ...what are you actually "doing" here with this to get the live water ??
I think, pretty well the same thing the Americans do with their "mental water diversion". If you remember, it was customary for many years to put an iron bar vertically into the ground over the (dowsed) water distant from an existing but inadequate borehole or well and bang it over towards the well to conduct the diversion. Then around 1968 someone like Jim K didn't have a bar with him but the water appeared anyway, after that he just told it firmly to do the necessary and since then that's become the standard mode, though I'm sure people who can't swallow the idea still use bars. The British have always been resistant to water diversion and so far as I can detect it got to the USA via the Italian-Americans from the Phoenicians. It's the Moses thing: strike the rock and water will come.

You can systemise the mental order thing by using a pendulum: tell it to act as an indicator when the job is done and you can turn your mind to other things. Since I'm a blink dowser, I use a blink. Actually I suspect the pendulum is better because it can tell you when you haven't got the recipe quite right and what I call a "holistic balancing thought" is needed. This is like bribing the universe to do your bidding by giving it some (abstract) thought energy it needs. Maybe this merely gets rid of internal guilts, but so what.

We do not have a well , it is the city water supply. Quantity is therefore not the issue but quality sure would be. Does this live water idea work for that as well ? Are you tapping into aquafers...what exactly are you moving in terms of water element? I would like very much to under
...stand. I'm not sure I know the answer to this. It's wide open. Some people "purify" their water mentally anyway, don't they ? Scientific tests have shown recently it's not just fancy, too. I've found I can greatly reduce furring in my kettle by giving it a good talking-to, but I am still sufficiently in thrall to the "scientific-rationale" religion to feel I need some instant feedback to help me do water purification.

I don't think live water is the same as primary water. If I do a piece of "guided writing" on it, there seem to be these options:-

Hydrological cycle: rain/aquifers/evaporation/condensation/rain.
Primary water 1: water generated by granite under great pressure. The
aluminium atoms in the granite reform to hydrogen.
Primary water 2: water generated by cooling magma. A similar fission process.
Primary water 3: water generated by secondary volcanic (metamorphic)rocks under great pressure. A similar process, but aluminium doesn't seem to figure.
Live water: this is a kind of within-earth hydrological cycle not involving the atmosphere. It is closely in tune with human thought processes and has the characteristic of being teleologically directed, which is to say, it prepares itself way ahead for a dowser's call for it. It promises to save us from drought. It can take from the other systems as required.
Technical water: not free water like the others but a type of live water stored in hydrates of minerals. It acts as a reservoir for live water.

What interests me about live water is that it can become artesian to order so you don't have to drill for it. Again, this is something some dowsers can do better than others.

(The weirdos invade water-divining ! Is nothing sacred ?)
Dan Wilson
 

live water

Postby C hagey » Wed Jul 27, 2005 10:22 pm

Ian the one book I do have on dowsing is one you suggested, Patterns of the Past, so I read that entry on geospirals - I must confess that I have no experince at water dowsing and try as I have on occasion to get the earth energy lines Underwood draws in this book, I cannot quite seem to sense the patterns his way. I have plenty of experience using a pendulum - mostly for energy field of humans - but I have not put my skill to use in the field of water finding. It is something that really draws me though...

I *really like the live water concept and will be exploring this much more Dan! Is there any research from dowsers who have gone to places where drought is very bad (like some African countries -- and much of the western US ) and having success with live water redirecting?

Thanks much,
Chris
C hagey
 

Re: live water

Postby Dan Wilson » Thu Jul 28, 2005 9:23 am

Chris wrote: Is there any research from dowsers who have gone to places where drought is very bad (like some African countries -- and much of the western US ) and having success with live water redirecting?
Obviously the Americans will be getting into this - Jim K already - but when I suggested in their Congress presentation the Zambia team might look into water purification by thought, seeing that there are people well ahead of us on this, they turned it away uneasily with a joke. As in natural medicine, there are layers of fear and orthodoxy within the discipline to be washed away. So live water will be coming along later in their case. Usually that means via someone new.
Dan Wilson
 

live water

Postby Chagey » Sun Jul 31, 2005 2:30 am

am thinking you should know that I am an American Dan....I live in Michigan and came to post tonight because of something very interesting that came up with this live water concept ...we have had an exceedingly gorgoeus summer day and I've been outside all day long gardening and enjoying. I thought I was ready to be inside when it got dark but was lured outside by my nicotianas and the planets in the clear night sky. (I have night blooming nicotianas which are very , very fragrant )

Well I walked around to one small spot of the nicotianas so I could smell them even better - and this is a place where I had long suspected was a blind spring or at the very least Some type of water element below - and as I was standing there just breathing in the night I got this subtle color impression visual of a wavy aquamarine color line undulating about 4 feet away. I suppose you could call it more a clairvoyant visual though I really couldn't say this would be accurate. It was an imporession more than anything , but it definitely had a green-blue color. Along with this , the idea of live water came to mind.

It was not exactly on the spot that I'd always felt was a blind spring, but it was close to it. Instead of getting my pendulum out I decided to use my hands . Has anyone ever done this? I use them in the same way as a polarity duo would be used . Kind of like a willow fork, except that when I hit something interesting my hands will be pushed wider apart or closer together instead of pointing downwards.

And when I walked to stand right on top of the place where I was seeing this undulating image, my hands really went widely apart. I walked along a bit, backwards, forwards and in other ares to see what my habnds owuld do. There were places where my hands opened up quite a bit, and places where they were fairly close together, but no place where I saw such a wide spread as over that one area. (it is a rather small are, about one meter by one meter)

I felt that would be where a spring would actually come up if I were to call it. Of course, this is in the grass in our yard and we have no need of it, but the idea that I could look at my entire yard so quickly and "spot" this feature since it drew attention to itself - glowing in that color and undulating - was very intriguing. Has anyone had this happen before? I also wonder if I was able to do this because it was night.

Not having "dowsed" for water with my hands like this before I cannot say whether this is usual or not - but I certainly think it merits further practice since it requires nothing beyond our hands!

Does anyone else ever dowse this way? Has anyone ever seen any type of visual like that to signify water or springs beyond the dowsing patterns?
Chagey
 

Re: live water

Postby Dan Wilson » Mon Aug 08, 2005 9:48 am

Chagey wrote: Instead of getting my pendulum out I decided to use my hands . Has anyone ever done this?
----snip----
Does anyone else ever dowse this way? Has anyone ever seen any type of visual like that to signify water or springs beyond the dowsing patterns?
I don't have much experience in water-finding but dowsers get asked to do everything in the end regardless of track record and several times I've been asked about plots of land in southern Spain, where the mains water is both very hard and erratic in supply, and anyway not available miles out in the country.

I usually start by getting "a connection" to the plot (this is always distant and rarely "proximate", i.e. standing on the place) and allowing vague impressions to float into my mind. This way, small good supplies can be distinguished from larger but contaminated ones which can be used for irrigation. I need to know how easily drilled for these supplies are so go on resting my mind on them until they deliver in terms of being in cracks or beds of gravel where you can drill anywhere.

Only then do I do conventional map dowsing with a pendulum (bunch of keys in my case) to get a reasonably close site location.

In practice the client always calls in another dowser to do the site work, because that's always several years later when they have found a driller and steeled themselves to pay for the bore. In fact I rather suspect that none of my work is ever used because all dowsers start from scratch anyway unless they're inquisitive like me and want to find out what "X's water which I think is no good" was. Usually I find X wasn't specifying steady yield in a dry year or something simple like that.

This sort of thing crops up a lot with natural remedies - the client has been using a homoeopathic remedy and I'm puzzled why I don't detect it, so "have a look" and it's because homoeopathy or an earlier dowser has been working at a quite different level of causation. Big subject.
Dan Wilson
 

Water and thoughtforms

Postby Pauline Roberts » Wed Dec 21, 2005 11:50 pm

Hi all,

Water purification via thoughtforms is certainly being used in the US, I was taught 'thought form' water filters some 10 years ago by Carl Bracy (master water diviner) at an ASD conference, and further extensions of this are being pioneered by Raymon Grace http://www.raymongrace.com another class act as a dowser. Emoto's work http://www.hado.net clearly shows that water has consciousness and can store information and I am sure people are familiar with that aspect...all we (those interested in such things) are doing is exploring what else it can do. Haven't found an end to it yet!

For us dowsers? I can only say try it with your own water supply at home, or just each glass of water you drink. When you clear and then programme water it makes a huge difference to its aura; and luckily, as dowsers we can check this out for ourselves or as they do in the US sometimes get it chemically tested before and afterwards! Then you can start programming it to provide whatever you need.....but hey, slowly does it...my programmed chocolate cake water doesn't give me quite the same buzz as chocolate cake yet.

As for water diversion, yes, just done another one with two others on a well that was drilled too short. What did we do? Stood 'round it and asked respectfully that the water vein that we knew was there moved upwards to fill the bore. (After ascertaining by dowsing that it was prepared to do so) Geologically impossible...but there's water in that darn well now and no, oh unbelievers, it hasn't rained and it was drier than a Pom's towel before we started. I don't claim to be an expert on any of this but I am happy to try anything and if it works, I use it again and again and again until it doesn't work...and thence a new technique usually reveals itself.

I appreciate why our BSD water dowsers in Africa might prefer not to go down such routes as yet, each to their own. Their work - in walking their talk and paying their own way - speaks legions for their committment and integrity anyway to making something good happen already against many odds. I guess until I'd done a few of these I didn't quite have the faith either and in a discerning audience that's how it should be.

In terms of feeling water, I've seen another deviceless dowser, Jenny-Lee Christison (Australia) feel the 7 bands of a water vein (if you're tuned to that aspect) with her hands...she feels them like little humps in the road as she walks across the vein, palms down and I've confirmed the veins she finds with my own dowsing (deviced). Quartz veins can throw her off a little though she finds. I use deviceless dowsing myself for water but I really do prefer a tool for professional water work, maybe it's just a question of faith too.....

Well, there's my 2 litres worth and trust some of it was interesting.

Kind regards

Pauline
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Re: Water and thoughtforms

Postby Dan Wilson » Thu Dec 22, 2005 1:19 pm

Pauline Roberts wrote:For us dowsers? I can only say try it with your own water supply at home, or just each glass of water you drink. When you clear and then programme water it makes a huge difference to its aura; and luckily, as dowsers we can check this out for ourselves or as they do in the US sometimes get it chemically tested before and afterwards! Then you can start programming it to provide whatever you need.....but hey, slowly does it...my programmed chocolate cake water doesn't give me quite the same buzz as chocolate cake yet.
But we keep forgetting to do it ! I'm reminded of the route for non-dowsers to take, which is to use a cardboard or rod pyramid and put the water in that for an hour. "The pyramid does" what they've been told the pyramid does (it has to be programmed) and bingo.

An extreme case of this arose in the BBC during the pyramid craze around 1970. Cyril Ray, the BBC's tame wine expert and father of comedian Ted, was renowned for saying the BBC canteen white wine was the worst anyone in Europe had the crust to charge money for. Colleagues noticed that a very good French white was available in exactly similar bottles, so they obtained a case of each and soaked the labels off half of each.

Then they placed the unlabelled BBC wine in a pyramid and told it it was the French wine, and did the reverse with the unlabelled French wine. I wasn't told how long they left the wine in the pyramid but if I dowse it, it was 24 hours.

Then they held a tasting. Cyril declared the "pyramidded" BBC to be the French wine and the "pyramidded" French wine to be the disgusting stuff sold upstairs. Great hilarity. I think the labelled wine was a control of some kind.

The question does arise, who or what had been changed, Cyril Ray or the wine ?

I appreciate why our BSD water dowsers in Africa might prefer not to go down such routes as yet, each to their own. Their work - in walking their talk and paying their own way - speaks legions for their committment and integrity anyway to making something good happen already against many odds. I guess until I'd done a few of these I didn't quite have the faith either and in a discerning audience that's how it should be.
Plus, of course, Zambia is a very straight Christian place and you'd need to know where you stood before departing too severely from expected behaviour.
Dan Wilson
 

Postby Pauline Roberts » Thu Dec 22, 2005 10:02 pm

Dan,

You bring up an interesting point with your wine-into-wine story. You are correct of course, there are many ways to effect such change - orgonite, pyramids, programmed crystals, reiki symbols and all manner of other devices but intent is the cheapest! And indeed we do seem to prefer 'tools' over going alone. Maybe we are a bit scared about how 'powerful' we may actually be? Then where will we hide?

As to who is changed, it can't be a one way street in my book, there's change going on in the giver and 'receiver'. If one programmes one's water a la Grace for example, might one not also be programming one's own water within one's body? Or are those water molecules 'deaf'. I doubt that, must be some resonance...To me, it's why two dowsers can find two different energy flows at a 'sacred' site, for each interaction will be different for each dowser, sometimes subtly, sometimes very marked. The only mistake is to ever fight about who's right!

Just another 20 cc from South side.

Merry festive season and all that...

Kind regards

Pauline
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Live water

Postby Dan Wilson » Fri Dec 23, 2005 11:30 am

Pauline Roberts wrote:there are many ways to effect such change - orgonite, pyramids, programmed crystals, reiki symbols and all manner of other devices but intent is the cheapest! And indeed we do seem to prefer 'tools' over going alone. Maybe we are a bit scared about how 'powerful' we may actually be? Then where will we hide?
I'm always suspicious of jumping to conclusions on such things, in the way dowsers do wholesale because they think being a dowser gives them a special licence to pronounce on things without doing the work.

Why is a tool or a gismo important ? Here's what my "guided writing" says (it'll be coloured by my own inner fears, I do at least know that from previous sessions and mentally bringing in culturally-distant dowser colleagues to see what changes occur):-
--
The tool or the gismo does "license" the user to carry out a mental action which otherwise they would regard as far-fetched or even risky. The important thing in mental exercises is for the thinker to remain relaxed and content, so that for example, non-religious dowsers would feel it a breach of their working principles to bring in a supernatural power and religious ones would feel it pointless not to. In your case you have a select few extreme fears which wholly inhibit any mental action which includes the following existential elements:-

The years 1852 and 1877.
Organs and other musical instruments built or modified during those two years.
Love from someone you consider has not done adequate research on you.
Swimming in deep water where there might be creatures which could harm you.
Any bridge or high structure supported by ropes or cables in tension.
[I was aware of these, except the "unlicensed love" and "deep water" ones - DW]

In order to circumnavigate these fears, you can and do employ techniques which have the effect of erasing them from your mind - for example despite having learnt a number of toolless dowsing systems you still employ a rose quartz pendulum in your clinical work because it disposes entirely of the love problem. It is exactly in these areas that dowsing "shibboleths" [that's methods or props which are supposedly essential, beneficial, unwise or forbidden - DW] come to have genuine value. Only the perfect dowser can do entirely without.
--end
Dan Wilson
 

Postby Richard L. Farr » Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:20 am

I simply don't buy Mr. Wilson's blanket relativism regarding dowsing tools as being purely and only of idiosyncratic subjective value; I am convinced from my studies that under certain circumstances various types of tools or assists do have a definite objective value (usually of an enhancing nature).
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Postby griff » Thu Jul 06, 2006 3:11 pm

Standing water level in boreholes.

When recording rest water levels over the years in new borehole sources (for compliance with uk environment agency abstraction licence applications) I have noticed that rest water levels are not only affected by atmospheric pressure but also by the influence of the Diurnal Wave. The differential can be disregarded when compiling records submitted to EA.
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Postby Grahame Gardner » Thu Jul 06, 2006 3:41 pm

Hi Griff;

What do you mean by 'diurnal wave'? Is this something to do with tides and the moon's influence? How much of a variation occurs with this?
Grahame
The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it - Terry Pratchett.
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